Rumsfeld:Deutschland und Frankreich sind ein Problem
- Ersteller Fetzy
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Hunble schrieb:
BULLSHIT!
Hunble schrieb:
Hunble, you are sick!
@all
Glory and approbation to Schorsch the Bush, Lord of Love and Destroyer of Evil! For he's the one to see who's guilty while others still search for any kind of evidence!
Seltsam...seit heute fühle ich plötzlich eine Art von ...Nationalstolz aufkeimen...strange...
Seltsam...seit heute fühle ich plötzlich eine Art von ...Nationalstolz aufkeimen...strange...
[quote="Bundeskanzler]
Thank you for this enlightenment, honey!
[/quote]
Well honey, what have you done today to help the people of Iraq? Have you supported the government that has made nothing but slaves, of the people of Iraq?
Perhaps I have not asked the correct questions lately. By what method do you think America will liberate Iraq?
Do you honestly believe that America will fly 1000 bombers over Iraq each day and destroy all life in the country? Perhaps use nuclear weapons and win the war in about 20 minutes?
America does tell the world exactly what it will do. Stop and just listen for a second.
Iraq must destroy all of their weapons of mass destruction, or America will do it for them. Very simple, and they have until next Monday to do so.
If Iraq fails to destroy their weapons of mass destruction by next Monday, the world must assume that they intend to use them for attacks upon civilians. Weapons of mass destruction have no valid military purpose and are only useful for the murder of civilians.
Our fight is not with the Iraq people, only with their government. We are talking about very few people living in that country who will be targets and there is absolutely no need for large scale bombing.
American weapons can hit their targets with 1 meter accuracy, very few lives will actually be lost.
In only a fews months from today, we will know the results. Believe me, I am taking notes as to who supported the criminal government of Iraq.
Like a puppy that shits in the house, I will rub your nose in it for years to come.
Each and every one of us is responsible for our personal choices. If you do something stupid, then you will be held accountable for your actions.
This is not a debate between peace and war. America will liberate Iraq unless it fully complies with the international laws. Actually if Iraq fully complied with the UN laws, everyone could go home nd absolutely nothing would happen.
The only question is rather personal. Do you support the criminal actions of the Iraq government?
So, make your choices wisely....
Thank you for this enlightenment, honey!
[/quote]
Well honey, what have you done today to help the people of Iraq? Have you supported the government that has made nothing but slaves, of the people of Iraq?
Perhaps I have not asked the correct questions lately. By what method do you think America will liberate Iraq?
Do you honestly believe that America will fly 1000 bombers over Iraq each day and destroy all life in the country? Perhaps use nuclear weapons and win the war in about 20 minutes?
America does tell the world exactly what it will do. Stop and just listen for a second.
Iraq must destroy all of their weapons of mass destruction, or America will do it for them. Very simple, and they have until next Monday to do so.
If Iraq fails to destroy their weapons of mass destruction by next Monday, the world must assume that they intend to use them for attacks upon civilians. Weapons of mass destruction have no valid military purpose and are only useful for the murder of civilians.
Our fight is not with the Iraq people, only with their government. We are talking about very few people living in that country who will be targets and there is absolutely no need for large scale bombing.
American weapons can hit their targets with 1 meter accuracy, very few lives will actually be lost.
In only a fews months from today, we will know the results. Believe me, I am taking notes as to who supported the criminal government of Iraq.
Like a puppy that shits in the house, I will rub your nose in it for years to come.
Each and every one of us is responsible for our personal choices. If you do something stupid, then you will be held accountable for your actions.
This is not a debate between peace and war. America will liberate Iraq unless it fully complies with the international laws. Actually if Iraq fully complied with the UN laws, everyone could go home nd absolutely nothing would happen.
The only question is rather personal. Do you support the criminal actions of the Iraq government?
So, make your choices wisely....
Lustig, die amerikanische Sicht der Dinge präsentiert von humble: 
Deutschland und Frankreich als Schurken die die USA von der Befreiung der irakischen pipelines, ähem, Bevölkerung abhalten.
Was für Gegensatz zur "ältesten Demokratie der Welt" ( Griechenland und die germanischen Things mal kurz vergessen
) die sich so vorbildlich für Menschenrechte in Südamerika und Afrika eingesetzt haben und auch immer schön brav ihre Mitgliederbeiträge für die UN zahlen ( ).
[ironie]
Was für ein Glück, dass die USA eine so große politische Rolle spielen!
[/ironie]
Jetzt mal im Ernst: Was will dieser ehem. Besatzungssoldat hier eigentlich? Kriegt er für seine Show ´nen Zuschuss zur kargen Army-Rente?
Deutschland und Frankreich als Schurken die die USA von der Befreiung der irakischen pipelines, ähem, Bevölkerung abhalten.
Was für Gegensatz zur "ältesten Demokratie der Welt" ( Griechenland und die germanischen Things mal kurz vergessen
) die sich so vorbildlich für Menschenrechte in Südamerika und Afrika eingesetzt haben und auch immer schön brav ihre Mitgliederbeiträge für die UN zahlen ( ).[ironie]
Was für ein Glück, dass die USA eine so große politische Rolle spielen!
[/ironie]
Jetzt mal im Ernst: Was will dieser ehem. Besatzungssoldat hier eigentlich? Kriegt er für seine Show ´nen Zuschuss zur kargen Army-Rente?
forcemagick
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ja also ich fands ja erst ganz interessant mit hunble zu diskutieren... aber zuhehmend hängt mir das zum hals raus und ich weiß gar nicht wo ich noch anfangen soll ihm auseinanderzusetzen wo und warum und weshalb...
irgendwie kommt er mir indoktiriniert vor... naja.. andere länder andere infolage...
aber die argumentation, dass die iraker ihre chemo/bio-waffen ab montag vernichten müssen und zwar gaaanz gaaanz offen.... und wenn sie keine biowaffen vernichten, weil sie vielleicht keine mehr haben.... dann werden sie angegriffen...
irgendwie kommt er mir indoktiriniert vor... naja.. andere länder andere infolage...
aber die argumentation, dass die iraker ihre chemo/bio-waffen ab montag vernichten müssen und zwar gaaanz gaaanz offen.... und wenn sie keine biowaffen vernichten, weil sie vielleicht keine mehr haben.... dann werden sie angegriffen...
[quote="Bundeskanzler]
BULLSHIT!
[/quote]
My, such an outstanding display of historical understanding of international laws.
When America was attacked on 9-11, Article 5 of the NATO charter was invokes when member nations voted and approved the resolution withing a fews days.
In other words, when the member nations of NATO approved the invocations of Article 5 of the charter, each nations entered into a state of war.
"The Parties agree that an armed attack against one or more of them in Europe or North America shall be considered an attack against them all .."
-------------
The North Atlantic Treaty
Washington D.C. - 4 April 1949
The Parties to this Treaty reaffirm their faith in the purposes and principles of the Charter of the United Nations and their desire to live in peace with all peoples and all governments.
They are determined to safeguard the freedom, common heritage and civilisation of their peoples, founded on the principles of democracy, individual liberty and the rule of law. They seek to promote stability and well-being in the North Atlantic area.
They are resolved to unite their efforts for collective defence and for the preservation of peace and security. They therefore agree to this North Atlantic Treaty :
Article 1
The Parties undertake, as set forth in the Charter of the United Nations, to settle any international dispute in which they may be involved by peaceful means in such a manner that international peace and security and justice are not endangered, and to refrain in their international relations from the threat or use of force in any manner inconsistent with the purposes of the United Nations.
Article 2
The Parties will contribute toward the further development of peaceful and friendly international relations by strengthening their free institutions, by bringing about a better understanding of the principles upon which these institutions are founded, and by promoting conditions of stability and well-being. They will seek to eliminate conflict in their international economic policies and will encourage economic collaboration between any or all of them.
Article 3
In order more effectively to achieve the objectives of this Treaty, the Parties, separately and jointly, by means of continuous and effective self-help and mutual aid, will maintain and develop their individual and collective capacity to resist armed attack.
Article 4
The Parties will consult together whenever, in the opinion of any of them, the territorial integrity, political independence or security of any of the Parties is threatened.
Article 5
The Parties agree that an armed attack against one or more of them in Europe or North America shall be considered an attack against them all and consequently they agree that, if such an armed attack occurs, each of them, in exercise of the right of individual or collective self-defence recognised by Article 51 of the Charter of the United Nations, will assist the Party or Parties so attacked by taking forthwith, individually and in concert with the other Parties, such action as it deems necessary, including the use of armed force, to restore and maintain the security of the North Atlantic area.
Any such armed attack and all measures taken as a result thereof shall immediately be reported to the Security Council. Such measures shall be terminated when the Security Council has taken the measures necessary to restore and maintain international peace and security .
Article 6 (1)
For the purpose of Article 5, an armed attack on one or more of the Parties is deemed to include an armed attack:
on the territory of any of the Parties in Europe or North America, on the Algerian Departments of France (2), on the territory of or on the Islands under the jurisdiction of any of the Parties in the North Atlantic area north of the Tropic of Cancer;
on the forces, vessels, or aircraft of any of the Parties, when in or over these territories or any other area in Europe in which occupation forces of any of the Parties were stationed on the date when the Treaty entered into force or the Mediterranean Sea or the North Atlantic area north of the Tropic of Cancer.
Article 7
This Treaty does not affect, and shall not be interpreted as affecting in any way the rights and obligations under the Charter of the Parties which are members of the United Nations, or the primary responsibility of the Security Council for the maintenance of international peace and security.
Article 8
Each Party declares that none of the international engagements now in force between it and any other of the Parties or any third State is in conflict with the provisions of this Treaty, and undertakes not to enter into any international engagement in conflict with this Treaty.
Article 9
The Parties hereby establish a Council, on which each of them shall be represented, to consider matters concerning the implementation of this Treaty. The Council shall be so organised as to be able to meet promptly at any time. The Council shall set up such subsidiary bodies as may be necessary; in particular it shall establish immediately a defence committee which shall recommend measures for the implementation of Articles 3 and 5.
Article 10
The Parties may, by unanimous agreement, invite any other European State in a position to further the principles of this Treaty and to contribute to the security of the North Atlantic area to accede to this Treaty. Any State so invited may become a Party to the Treaty by depositing its instrument of accession with the Government of the United States of America. The Government of the United States of America will inform each of the Parties of the deposit of each such instrument of accession.
Article 11
This Treaty shall be ratified and its provisions carried out by the Parties in accordance with their respective constitutional processes. The instruments of ratification shall be deposited as soon as possible with the Government of the United States of America, which will notify all the other signatories of each deposit. The Treaty shall enter into force between the States which have ratified it as soon as the ratifications of the majority of the signatories, including the ratifications of Belgium, Canada, France, Luxembourg, the Netherlands, the United Kingdom and the United States, have been deposited and shall come into effect with respect to other States on the date of the deposit of their ratifications. (3)
Article 12
After the Treaty has been in force for ten years, or at any time thereafter, the Parties shall, if any of them so requests, consult together for the purpose of reviewing the Treaty, having regard for the factors then affecting peace and security in the North Atlantic area, including the development of universal as well as regional arrangements under the Charter of the United Nations for the maintenance of international peace and security.
Article 13
After the Treaty has been in force for twenty years, any Party may cease to be a Party one year after its notice of denunciation has been given to the Government of the United States of America, which will inform the Governments of the other Parties of the deposit of each notice of denunciation.
Article 14
This Treaty, of which the English and French texts are equally authentic, shall be deposited in the archives of the Government of the United States of America. Duly certified copies will be transmitted by that Government to the Governments of other signatories.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Footnotes :
The definition of the territories to which Article 5 applies was revised by Article 2 of the Protocol to the North Atlantic Treaty on the accession of Greece and Turkey signed on 22 October 1951.
On January 16, 1963, the North Atlantic Council noted that insofar as the former Algerian Departments of France were concerned, the relevant clauses of this Treaty had become inapplicable as from July 3, 1962.
The Treaty came into force on 24 August 1949, after the deposition of the ratifications of all signatory states
BULLSHIT!
[/quote]
My, such an outstanding display of historical understanding of international laws.
When America was attacked on 9-11, Article 5 of the NATO charter was invokes when member nations voted and approved the resolution withing a fews days.
In other words, when the member nations of NATO approved the invocations of Article 5 of the charter, each nations entered into a state of war.
"The Parties agree that an armed attack against one or more of them in Europe or North America shall be considered an attack against them all .."
-------------
The North Atlantic Treaty
Washington D.C. - 4 April 1949
The Parties to this Treaty reaffirm their faith in the purposes and principles of the Charter of the United Nations and their desire to live in peace with all peoples and all governments.
They are determined to safeguard the freedom, common heritage and civilisation of their peoples, founded on the principles of democracy, individual liberty and the rule of law. They seek to promote stability and well-being in the North Atlantic area.
They are resolved to unite their efforts for collective defence and for the preservation of peace and security. They therefore agree to this North Atlantic Treaty :
Article 1
The Parties undertake, as set forth in the Charter of the United Nations, to settle any international dispute in which they may be involved by peaceful means in such a manner that international peace and security and justice are not endangered, and to refrain in their international relations from the threat or use of force in any manner inconsistent with the purposes of the United Nations.
Article 2
The Parties will contribute toward the further development of peaceful and friendly international relations by strengthening their free institutions, by bringing about a better understanding of the principles upon which these institutions are founded, and by promoting conditions of stability and well-being. They will seek to eliminate conflict in their international economic policies and will encourage economic collaboration between any or all of them.
Article 3
In order more effectively to achieve the objectives of this Treaty, the Parties, separately and jointly, by means of continuous and effective self-help and mutual aid, will maintain and develop their individual and collective capacity to resist armed attack.
Article 4
The Parties will consult together whenever, in the opinion of any of them, the territorial integrity, political independence or security of any of the Parties is threatened.
Article 5
The Parties agree that an armed attack against one or more of them in Europe or North America shall be considered an attack against them all and consequently they agree that, if such an armed attack occurs, each of them, in exercise of the right of individual or collective self-defence recognised by Article 51 of the Charter of the United Nations, will assist the Party or Parties so attacked by taking forthwith, individually and in concert with the other Parties, such action as it deems necessary, including the use of armed force, to restore and maintain the security of the North Atlantic area.
Any such armed attack and all measures taken as a result thereof shall immediately be reported to the Security Council. Such measures shall be terminated when the Security Council has taken the measures necessary to restore and maintain international peace and security .
Article 6 (1)
For the purpose of Article 5, an armed attack on one or more of the Parties is deemed to include an armed attack:
on the territory of any of the Parties in Europe or North America, on the Algerian Departments of France (2), on the territory of or on the Islands under the jurisdiction of any of the Parties in the North Atlantic area north of the Tropic of Cancer;
on the forces, vessels, or aircraft of any of the Parties, when in or over these territories or any other area in Europe in which occupation forces of any of the Parties were stationed on the date when the Treaty entered into force or the Mediterranean Sea or the North Atlantic area north of the Tropic of Cancer.
Article 7
This Treaty does not affect, and shall not be interpreted as affecting in any way the rights and obligations under the Charter of the Parties which are members of the United Nations, or the primary responsibility of the Security Council for the maintenance of international peace and security.
Article 8
Each Party declares that none of the international engagements now in force between it and any other of the Parties or any third State is in conflict with the provisions of this Treaty, and undertakes not to enter into any international engagement in conflict with this Treaty.
Article 9
The Parties hereby establish a Council, on which each of them shall be represented, to consider matters concerning the implementation of this Treaty. The Council shall be so organised as to be able to meet promptly at any time. The Council shall set up such subsidiary bodies as may be necessary; in particular it shall establish immediately a defence committee which shall recommend measures for the implementation of Articles 3 and 5.
Article 10
The Parties may, by unanimous agreement, invite any other European State in a position to further the principles of this Treaty and to contribute to the security of the North Atlantic area to accede to this Treaty. Any State so invited may become a Party to the Treaty by depositing its instrument of accession with the Government of the United States of America. The Government of the United States of America will inform each of the Parties of the deposit of each such instrument of accession.
Article 11
This Treaty shall be ratified and its provisions carried out by the Parties in accordance with their respective constitutional processes. The instruments of ratification shall be deposited as soon as possible with the Government of the United States of America, which will notify all the other signatories of each deposit. The Treaty shall enter into force between the States which have ratified it as soon as the ratifications of the majority of the signatories, including the ratifications of Belgium, Canada, France, Luxembourg, the Netherlands, the United Kingdom and the United States, have been deposited and shall come into effect with respect to other States on the date of the deposit of their ratifications. (3)
Article 12
After the Treaty has been in force for ten years, or at any time thereafter, the Parties shall, if any of them so requests, consult together for the purpose of reviewing the Treaty, having regard for the factors then affecting peace and security in the North Atlantic area, including the development of universal as well as regional arrangements under the Charter of the United Nations for the maintenance of international peace and security.
Article 13
After the Treaty has been in force for twenty years, any Party may cease to be a Party one year after its notice of denunciation has been given to the Government of the United States of America, which will inform the Governments of the other Parties of the deposit of each notice of denunciation.
Article 14
This Treaty, of which the English and French texts are equally authentic, shall be deposited in the archives of the Government of the United States of America. Duly certified copies will be transmitted by that Government to the Governments of other signatories.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Footnotes :
The definition of the territories to which Article 5 applies was revised by Article 2 of the Protocol to the North Atlantic Treaty on the accession of Greece and Turkey signed on 22 October 1951.
On January 16, 1963, the North Atlantic Council noted that insofar as the former Algerian Departments of France were concerned, the relevant clauses of this Treaty had become inapplicable as from July 3, 1962.
The Treaty came into force on 24 August 1949, after the deposition of the ratifications of all signatory states
Servus!
Der wirkliche Kriegsgrund ist ja "unsere Wirtschaft zu sichern" (Zitat USA)! D.h. die wollen also die Ölquellen, diese befinden sich aber leider in fester Hand, nämlich in Französischer!
Deswegen bezweifle ich, das die Franzosen ihre Legion da in´n Kampf Seite an Seite mit ihren Erzfeinden, den Ami´s und den Briten, gegen ihren Wirtschaftsverbündeten schicken werden.
gruß
trashy
PS: Könnten wir uns auf eine Sprache einigen???
Der wirkliche Kriegsgrund ist ja "unsere Wirtschaft zu sichern" (Zitat USA)! D.h. die wollen also die Ölquellen, diese befinden sich aber leider in fester Hand, nämlich in Französischer!
Deswegen bezweifle ich, das die Franzosen ihre Legion da in´n Kampf Seite an Seite mit ihren Erzfeinden, den Ami´s und den Briten, gegen ihren Wirtschaftsverbündeten schicken werden.
gruß
trashy
PS: Könnten wir uns auf eine Sprache einigen???
forcemagick
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well i ask you
who attacked the usa?
who?
AL QUAIDA AL QUAIDA and not the iraq
forcemagick
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trashy schrieb:
nein nein es geht doch nur um die armen iraker, die laut einer umfrage den dringenden wunsch hegen durch einen krieg befreit zu werden....
muss ich da jetzt die ironie tags aussenrum machen?
Was für Gegensatz zur "ältesten Demokratie der Welt" ( Griechenland und die germanischen Things mal kurz vergessen
First off, The United States has never been a Democracy and never will be. The United States is a Republic.
When the United States was being created, the people involved studies all governments to include the Greeks and Romans. They understood that Democracy often results in mob rule and has never worked.
It was simply too easy to bribe the population and the results were a destruction of the historical governments.
As an alternative, the United States was created as a Republic. The population elects people to represent them. If the officials who have been selected to represent the people no longer follow the views of the population, they will be removed from office in a few years.
Now compare this with the current Iraq government.
forcemagick
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you say the usa are no democracy
well you call it a republic and you say that this is somethin completely different than a democracy
but your administration says it wants to liberate everyone from everything and they defend the democracy
interessting
well you call it a republic and you say that this is somethin completely different than a democracy
but your administration says it wants to liberate everyone from everything and they defend the democracy
interessting
BigBang schrieb:
Try to look for the thread "www.freerepublic.com" when people from this board discovered that strict conservative US forum. Some of us went over to discuss with them and all accounts were deleted sooner or later as they were distributing infamous opinions. When Paradewohlstandskind was kicked out, he invited Hunble to our board as he was the only one open enough to discuss with us.
@semball: if you see yourself able to speak English, please do so. Why? Politeness.
Agarthe
BigBang schrieb:
A member of this website visited www.freerepublic.com and attacked Americans. Many members of freerepublic enjoy an honest debate on subjects and I was ashamed that his comments were deleted.
I sent him a personal e-mail expressing my feelings about his comments being removed. He then invited me to this website for a continuation of the debate.
Although I lived in Germany for 4 years, I have not spoken the language since 1981. Last time I was in Germany, I fell very much in love with a woman in Meppen. She would only speak English, and I was only allowed to speak German. Unfortunately, 1981 was a long time ago and she decided not to marry me.
So you see, when I say that I love the German people, it is very real to me personally. 22 years later, I still think of my Gitta often.
Actually, I am ashamed that I am unable to write my comments in German, so please forgive.
These are very serious subjects and Europe seems to be getting a very distorted view. If I can answer specific questions, then I am more than happy to do so.
Unfortunately, some of the comments on this website do tend to get me upset. If I say something stupid, let me know and I will apologize.
You are absolutely correct and thank-you for remembering that. I have nothing but respect for most of the people on this website. Our views may be different, but by talking, perhaps we may learn to understand each other.
I am not some horrible monster. I spent 4 years risking my life in Germany to prevent a possible USSR invasion of your country. After my 4 years in Germany, I was transfered to White Sands Missile Range, New Mexico as a meteorologist (weather)
Weather is involved with everything that the military does. So, until I retired from the U.S. Army in 1994, I have been personally involved with many projects with the Army.
I am nobody special, but because my specialty was weather, I ended up being involved. All I can say is: if weather was involved, I was there.
Obviously, I will never tell you about anything classified. But if I can explain about something, then I am more than happy to help out.
Bundeskanzler
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Hunble schrieb:
Hunble, I don't have time to translate it, but beleive me - we are not in a "state of war".
The German Government schrieb:
Hunble schrieb:
Very funny! Do the other 270 Mio. Americans know that too?
Hunble schrieb:
... and ATTACKED Americans...
Hunble, Hunble... what's going wrong with you?
In Germany we call that "discussing" or "talking".
Hunble schrieb:
Me too!
Hunble schrieb:
Okay my little enemy - here is nice lecture written by an American guy for you. Maybe you beleive HIM!
also sorry, wenn ich so einen bullshit wie das folgende lesen muss, dann komme ich zu dem ergebnis, das wir es mit einem indoktrinierten ami zu tun haben, bei dem die gebetsmühlenartig vorgetragene propaganda der us-regierung eindeutig angeschlagen hat.
genau das ist es, was mich dabei so anwidert, dieses feinddenken, was dann auch noch auf eine persönliche ebene gehieft wird.
dream on baby, your president will be pleased to have such a brainwashed, uncritical thing like you.
genau das ist es, was mich dabei so anwidert, dieses feinddenken, was dann auch noch auf eine persönliche ebene gehieft wird.
dream on baby, your president will be pleased to have such a brainwashed, uncritical thing like you.
forcemagick
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ein geiles buch ist das
How do I say this kindly:
I personally know hundreds of people in the military.
I ran for government office this year.
I have a rather large family, even if I do not want to admit that I am a grandfather.
I have worked with many companies and have known many people.
Some of you have labeled me as an "Ultra Conservative" and that may be so. Of the hundreds of people I associate with, I am simple considered "normal."
Seriously, outside of the internet, I have never know anyone personally that has expressed the view that I have seen on this website.
Why is that?
Ok, my wife's sister earned her income by being a professional protester. It did not matter what the issue was, she was paid to stand outside a government building and protest it. For obvious reasons, her political views are not exactly highly respected.
I love to explore how other people think. That is why I have joined this website. These concepts are so outside of anything that I know, that it is like exploring another planet. Absolutely fascinating!
Once again, I do not know anyone in my personal life that has expressed simular views as I have read on this website.
I personally know hundreds of people in the military.
I ran for government office this year.
I have a rather large family, even if I do not want to admit that I am a grandfather.
I have worked with many companies and have known many people.
Some of you have labeled me as an "Ultra Conservative" and that may be so. Of the hundreds of people I associate with, I am simple considered "normal."
Seriously, outside of the internet, I have never know anyone personally that has expressed the view that I have seen on this website.
Why is that?
Ok, my wife's sister earned her income by being a professional protester. It did not matter what the issue was, she was paid to stand outside a government building and protest it. For obvious reasons, her political views are not exactly highly respected.
I love to explore how other people think. That is why I have joined this website. These concepts are so outside of anything that I know, that it is like exploring another planet. Absolutely fascinating!
Once again, I do not know anyone in my personal life that has expressed simular views as I have read on this website.
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